"giving us a preview of what a Palestinian state would really be like"
A more scientific preview of what a Palestinian state would really be like comes from polls conducted by two Palestinian polling institutes in the West Bank. Taken in Nov 2023 and March 2024, the show just over 70% Palestinian support for the October 7 atrocities and supplement empirical evidence of the popularity of Hamas videos of torture and murder on Telegram channels.
Not really. I just read their signs and listen to their chants and slogans. You know, "Death to Israel!" "Burn Tel Aviv to the ground!" "Go, Hamas!" "Jews back to Poland!" That kind of stuff, which I'd call pretty damned antisemitic. Why wouldn't you...?
I made the mistake of reading some "World Politics" articles on Substack about the "brave protestors" and how Israel is genociding everyone around them in all directions, and how we have to stand up to the Jews and Israel and Speak Truth To Power.
I had ideas on replying in the comment sections, but then realized it would be a waste of time. All the comments were the same mindless braying about how great the authors were and how much they hated Israel. The hatred for Israel and the Jews is somehow so deeply embedded now these people can't see the satanic cruelty in front of their faces.
And "Mostafa" is another voice pretending to sound reasonable while he spews "exterminate all Jews and Israel" behind your back.
"exterminate all jews and Israel"! Never did I say exterminate the jews (I am not bloodlust zionist/settler), I suggested them going to a better place than sit in Israel (meaning that I see them as humans and worth a life unlike how they view Palestinians) fighting existential wars all the time here in ME. It is ridiculous that you equate all jews with zionists but even more ridiculous equating jews (people, however, you define them) with Israel (a state). As if these people cannot defined except by the state or land or killing other people or historical injustice, I am not sure how to deal with them in our lifetime.
Right, send the Jews back to Poland and Russia. That's so enlightened and humane of you. How about Jews of Ethiopian extraction? Should they be sent back to Ethiopia. How about Jews who came emigrated to Israel from various Arab countries—having been driven out? Where are they supposed to go? Behind your pretense of solicitude for the Jews, you're nothing but an antisemite, a hateful bigot, an advocate for genocide.
You think that we live in a jungle in 21st century? you think If people are sent back, they will be killed? that's a fantasy if you cannot grasp that humans can be peaceful and coexist, then please save yourself from insulting me (spend time with your loved ones instead)
For me, zionism is about defining jewish people in terms of a state (which entails like the formation of settler colonial projects the destruction of certain people's culture and sense of being [Palestinians or for a better term some arab inhabitants in the region at the time of jews' arrival]), the biggest problem with support for zionism now is that America is interested in bringing some hall marks of the country and post-cold war order (which I long admired as third-world country person) like free speech (intellectual discussions everywhere), skepticism of authority (multiple centers of power), upward/social mobility (diverse economic opportunity), institutional links between government, academia and private sector (unprecedented educational institutions) to save jewish people from the monsters they become. I hope you reflect on whether it was worth saving America or Israel (as geographic location) now. Despite the Holocaust history, Poland now is actually good country for jews, economically and military prosperous and jews are now the best group in terms of science and innovation, why insist on being located in one place? Herzl suggested Argentina perviously instead of palestine, now Argentina with Milei is also becoming a good country. I think jewish people can find better places than in 20th century.
What the hell qualifies you to specify where and where not Jews should live? Suppose I were to say that the Palestinian Arabs should be shipped back to Arabia? Would you be OK with that? Or would you melt down into a pool of blather about “indigenous peoples”?
Regarding shipping palestinians to Arabia, I already had this discussion (https://substack.com/@arrrbee/note/c-54904104) and I noted how this is detrimental to Israel and US more than palestinians.
Really, you know that Israel made US defund UNESCO (along with subsidiary bodies) because they recognised Palestine as a state (only UN agency to do so) (what does that mean?). Perviously, a museum showing palestinian heritage was attacked by jews because they do not accept the recognition of palestinian people as united culture (what does that mean). UNESCO has a lot of heritage sites in palestine and this infuriates Israel (a lot of it was destroyed). Lastly, people use genocide today is because we saw it perviously happen, did not prevent it and now we condemn it (in cases of ottman empire, america, argentina, namibia, rawanda), supposedly, human progress involves setting rules that are more humane rather than unhumane and prevent us from repeating mistakes.
There is a legislation that makes US defund any international organization that admits palestine as a state (I think it is one of the products of the influence of jewish lobby). US paid around $619 million to be readmitted last year because of fear of China taking over UNESCO.
"giving us a preview of what a Palestinian state would really be like"
A more scientific preview of what a Palestinian state would really be like comes from polls conducted by two Palestinian polling institutes in the West Bank. Taken in Nov 2023 and March 2024, the show just over 70% Palestinian support for the October 7 atrocities and supplement empirical evidence of the popularity of Hamas videos of torture and murder on Telegram channels.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/poll-over-70-palestinians-still-maintain-hamas-correct-to-commit-oct-7-atrocities/
https://www.jns.org/three-in-four-palestinians-support-hamass-massacre/
That too...
Accusing protestors you disagree with of "anti-Semitism" is just a tired cliche at this point, the coldest of cold takes.
Not really. I just read their signs and listen to their chants and slogans. You know, "Death to Israel!" "Burn Tel Aviv to the ground!" "Go, Hamas!" "Jews back to Poland!" That kind of stuff, which I'd call pretty damned antisemitic. Why wouldn't you...?
I made the mistake of reading some "World Politics" articles on Substack about the "brave protestors" and how Israel is genociding everyone around them in all directions, and how we have to stand up to the Jews and Israel and Speak Truth To Power.
I had ideas on replying in the comment sections, but then realized it would be a waste of time. All the comments were the same mindless braying about how great the authors were and how much they hated Israel. The hatred for Israel and the Jews is somehow so deeply embedded now these people can't see the satanic cruelty in front of their faces.
And "Mostafa" is another voice pretending to sound reasonable while he spews "exterminate all Jews and Israel" behind your back.
"exterminate all jews and Israel"! Never did I say exterminate the jews (I am not bloodlust zionist/settler), I suggested them going to a better place than sit in Israel (meaning that I see them as humans and worth a life unlike how they view Palestinians) fighting existential wars all the time here in ME. It is ridiculous that you equate all jews with zionists but even more ridiculous equating jews (people, however, you define them) with Israel (a state). As if these people cannot defined except by the state or land or killing other people or historical injustice, I am not sure how to deal with them in our lifetime.
Right, send the Jews back to Poland and Russia. That's so enlightened and humane of you. How about Jews of Ethiopian extraction? Should they be sent back to Ethiopia. How about Jews who came emigrated to Israel from various Arab countries—having been driven out? Where are they supposed to go? Behind your pretense of solicitude for the Jews, you're nothing but an antisemite, a hateful bigot, an advocate for genocide.
You think that we live in a jungle in 21st century? you think If people are sent back, they will be killed? that's a fantasy if you cannot grasp that humans can be peaceful and coexist, then please save yourself from insulting me (spend time with your loved ones instead)
Are you serious? Take a good long look at the state of the world and get back to me.
The Western Right's "solidarity" with the zionist cause corrupts them both
Ridiculous.
For me, zionism is about defining jewish people in terms of a state (which entails like the formation of settler colonial projects the destruction of certain people's culture and sense of being [Palestinians or for a better term some arab inhabitants in the region at the time of jews' arrival]), the biggest problem with support for zionism now is that America is interested in bringing some hall marks of the country and post-cold war order (which I long admired as third-world country person) like free speech (intellectual discussions everywhere), skepticism of authority (multiple centers of power), upward/social mobility (diverse economic opportunity), institutional links between government, academia and private sector (unprecedented educational institutions) to save jewish people from the monsters they become. I hope you reflect on whether it was worth saving America or Israel (as geographic location) now. Despite the Holocaust history, Poland now is actually good country for jews, economically and military prosperous and jews are now the best group in terms of science and innovation, why insist on being located in one place? Herzl suggested Argentina perviously instead of palestine, now Argentina with Milei is also becoming a good country. I think jewish people can find better places than in 20th century.
What the hell qualifies you to specify where and where not Jews should live? Suppose I were to say that the Palestinian Arabs should be shipped back to Arabia? Would you be OK with that? Or would you melt down into a pool of blather about “indigenous peoples”?
Regarding shipping palestinians to Arabia, I already had this discussion (https://substack.com/@arrrbee/note/c-54904104) and I noted how this is detrimental to Israel and US more than palestinians.
> which entails like the formation of settler colonial projects the destruction of certain people's culture and sense of being
Ok, now you sound like the people pulling down statues of Columbus and trying to turn Thanksgiving into "Native American Genocide Day".
Really, you know that Israel made US defund UNESCO (along with subsidiary bodies) because they recognised Palestine as a state (only UN agency to do so) (what does that mean?). Perviously, a museum showing palestinian heritage was attacked by jews because they do not accept the recognition of palestinian people as united culture (what does that mean). UNESCO has a lot of heritage sites in palestine and this infuriates Israel (a lot of it was destroyed). Lastly, people use genocide today is because we saw it perviously happen, did not prevent it and now we condemn it (in cases of ottman empire, america, argentina, namibia, rawanda), supposedly, human progress involves setting rules that are more humane rather than unhumane and prevent us from repeating mistakes.
Really? How did Israel make the US do that?
There is a legislation that makes US defund any international organization that admits palestine as a state (I think it is one of the products of the influence of jewish lobby). US paid around $619 million to be readmitted last year because of fear of China taking over UNESCO.
Thank you, Thomas. I recently started reading your feed and I am glad I did. Very thoughtful.
Seconded.
Great piece. The last line is perfect. Will be sharing.
Thanks for reading.
Well said. Thank you. 🙏